had a interesting talk with total seal a while back[keith jones and we were talking about oil control,he had said that windage trays don't work good because they actually prohibit oil from draining back to the sump fast enough,thus keeping it on the crank longer, i'd say i have to agree,IMO

 

I've heard others say that too... Just wasn't sure I believed it.

What's your opinion of scrapers?

 

Scraper: Good if it get's the oil off the of crank and back into the pan. Problem is good ones have to be made and having concentric counterweights helps that out a bunch! Like this:

Windage Tray: The windage tray depends on the design of the pan really, if the pan doesn't have a lot of volume or there is a lot of oil in the pan for the volume you need something to absorb the energy of the spinning oil hooked to the crank so it doesn't pick up the rest of the oil in the pan and uncover the pickup. Now if you have a dry sump or a very deep pan then you don't need that, the oil will have a place to drop to when the crank is spinning.

Depends on the application, Drag Racing motors are a LOT different in terms of oil needs compared to road racing/circle track motors.

Bret

 

I like the idea of having nothing in the way of anything.... generally speaking.

 

So you dont use scrapers Chris? Just curious as we are debating this subject also........We just got a Charlie's pan with just a built in screen......It has been recommended to just go with that and let the scraper thing alone??????

Do Pro-Stockers use scrapers?

 

With a dry sump do you need too?

 

I don't use scrapers... never have. Maybe something left on the table? I think with the right oilpan design they are not needed.

 

I was at a dyno session where some tests were being conducted on windage trays for a sbc application, several camera's and some really high end metering devices were employed and it was really a neat deal and amazing the oil of activity that takes place in the pan.

The "diamond stripper" style had the best ability to absorb the oils "energy" and return it to the pick-up the most effectively in a static environment generically speaking.

 

For years, with a wet sump, we ran a Moroso deep (10 1/4", 8 qt.) pan, a Milodon Diamond Stripper and a crank scraper with ~.035" clearance. When we went to a Charlie's pan, we tossed the windage tray but kept the crank scraper. When we went to a dry sump, using a Charlie's pan, we put in a zero clearance teflon crank scraper. We never did any ABA testing on the dyno, but we're happy with these combinations and most likely will continue to use Charlie's pans and a scraper.

 

have you guys had problems with pan rail leaks with the scraper? also with what has been said about windage trays is it better to use one in the pan than one bolted to the main studs? Farther away from the crank better?

 

have you guys had problems with pan rail leaks with the scraper?

Yes, we did on a Stock Eliminator car (BBC). I think it has something to do with the fact that there is no kick out on the right side of the pan, so the oil just acculates under the scraper and along the pan side. With the kick out it has a place to go, thats what our opinion is anyway. My car has a scraper and kickout and no leaks. I also use the diamond/directional type scraper in the pan with a bunch of other "baffeling" in the engine. Also, Bill Jenkins book has some interesting stuff about oil control and oil pans. A little dated, but you could find some relevance.

 

If your looking for some noticeable et gains from the oil pan your in the wrong place imo. I know the Nascar guys use to run a big pan with nothing in it. I don't think a drag car has enough time duration on a pass to really benifit from alot or crazy r and d in the pan. Maybe a max effort deal where your limited I'd consider spending the time on the pan.

 

If there was no oil pan under the block at all, that is the best possible scenario.

 

trying moroso oil pan with scraper for the first time will let you know

 

I use both, but I am slow. I have not had any oiling issues to date. No leaks. I use the "Right Stuff" for my pans and the scraper/tray.

 

So if many people believe there really isn't much 'performance' to be gained in the oil pan, why do drag racing engines have such huge pans when most other forms of motorsports don't?

 

Because most other forms of motorsports use dry sump systems in all but their most entry-level categories, and the crank center height in the faster road race & oval track cars is usually no higher than about 9.5" and in some cases it's as low as 6.5" from the ground.

 

Initial acceleration would be my best guess, in a wet application the amount of oil is tremendous.