Thanks.
Going down the strip with this piece of equipment is another world, entirely.

This weekend I had a couple or three passes with 100% throttle and wheel- spin on 3 first + partly 4. gear past 1/8- mile line to hook at the last 1/4. Went straight as a needle.
Did some tuning and got it to hook better and got better 60- feet (and ET's). Although- not satisfied yet, but consistent at 1.5- sec mark.

To my understanding, there's a lot to be learned before the package is well- tuned and the driver need tons of experience to handle it to the limit.
Still using clutch- pedal and blipping throttle. 5-6 years of SL with a trad clutch and H- shift; I have to reprogram my brain.

 

Congrats!
---Bill.

 

Uhhh? I don't know if I ever mentioned this; but I went with a LIBERTY LSC 5100, V-gate shifter.

Shifting clutchless, or maybe a small blipp on the pedal?

Improved my PB with 1 sec in the quarter. In the 9's now- first test. Will hit 8's this season- Guaranteed.

No, not driven on the street. No roadracing either. I might do that later, with a H-pattern shifter. Not in the near future....

 

Thanks Grant I will check it out

Steve

 

Here's a link to the ClutchTamer info page... ClutchTamer.com

I also have a new in-line hydraulic 2-stage clutch hit control system I call the Hitmaster, here's the link to it... ClutchTamer.com

Grant

 

Grant
Can you send me info in regards to the clutch tamer? Thanks brother!

Steve

 

I was talking with Jacob Lamb this fall. He races Coyote Stock and is sponsored by Gforce. He runs the 101A. He said he shifts his clutchless, and just pulls the gears. He said the stock faceplates have a 7 degree angle, and they cut it down to a much smaller one to allow it to pull out of gear easier. I forget the exact number. Anyway, he was launching with the front wheels about 2 feet in the air, and pulling 2nd gear at about the top of his wheelie to to tune of 10.0 in the 1/4 in cold air. Really impressive ride, and a nice guy. I asked if it popped out of gear like that, and he said it didn't.

Speaking with him or Gforce would provide more details. I don't think the toploader is going to be up to the task of the next engine... so I've been looking at these pretty hard.

 

I was talking with Jacob Lamb this fall. He races Coyote Stock and is sponsored by Gforce. He runs the 101A. He said he shifts his clutchless, and just pulls the gears. He said the stock faceplates have a 7 degree angle, and they cut it down to a much smaller one to allow it to pull out of gear easier. I forget the exact number. Anyway, he was launching with the front wheels about 2 feet in the air, and pulling 2nd gear at about the top of his wheelie to to tune of 10.0 in the 1/4 in cold air. Really impressive ride, and a nice guy. I asked if it popped out of gear like that, and he said it didn't.

Speaking with him or Gforce would provide more details. I don't think the toploader is going to be up to the task of the next engine... so I've been looking at these pretty hard.

Jacob is a customer of mine, he uses a ClutchTamer on that car
Before the G101 he used to run T5's, says he never broke another T5 after installing the 'tamer.

You might be surprised at what you can get thru your Toploader with a 'tamer controlling the hit. I've had the same small in/out Toploader behind a 700+ small block for around 10 years, never hurt it with the 'tamer controlling the hit. It's been 800+ for about 4 years now, same transmission. I should add that I also use a nitrous hit delay after launch, which basically holds off the nitrous hit until the clutch is almost locked up. If you look at data graphs very long you will notice that a manual trans car accelerates at a faster rate while the clutch is pulling the engine down, it's basically a boost that you get while the rotating assy is losing some of it's stored energy. I delay my nitrous a bit so that it comes in on the heels of that inertia boost, which in-turn makes overall power delivery much smoother for my radials and the no-prep surfaces that I like to run on.

Grant

 

I have a 5 speed liberty extreme. I have driven it on the street its a little tedious and if you let off it will pop out of gear. If you keep it under load not a problem. Base pressure on the clutch is low, I run a dual 10" from advanced clutches. I just like to be different I guess.

 

I would suggest you find somebody with a true clutchless trans who would let you just drive it around the pits. I'm sure you will see it's not something you'd want to try driving on the street. They are a pain in the ass to do anything except go wide open with. Shifting the Liberty clutch assisted five speed should be pretty easy just tapping the clutch pedal, once you figure how much clutch you need to lock it up in the higher gears, since even just tapping the pedal does disengage the disc for a split second.

 

I agree, the shifts happen as fast as you can yank the lever, there are some guys who will blip the throttle and yank the lever, but i dont see how that is any quicker than tapping the clutch, and it has to be much more stress on the transmission vs using the clutch.

 

So, no Drag week this year for you; me neither. Warp Speed goes to speed week too?

Anyway- maybe a true clutchless is what I really wanted.... Need to try this thing out - maybe I like it- maybe- as said above, it CAN be shifted clutcless.... Maybe use the rev-limiter; I gotta live & learn.

My pals, hot- rodding japs for street/ autoX & track, use a newer BMW trans, doing REAL "clutchless" gearing. Will take 1000Hp in a 4WD dragracing. The trans has 2 x internal cluchess; each consisting of 10 discs. It will shift in mere microseconds. Needs a stand- alone ECU and a a fabricated flywheel/ adapter + adapter for bellhousing. The trans weigh some 70- 80 kilos.... The way to go, maybe. No SFI- stuff. A 3mm steel sheet over the bellhousing would make it strip- legal? Cost is about 5-6000$ for all parts, including a 2. hand trans.

 

In order to shift clutchless on a transmission designed for clutch shifting, and without using aides like RPM activated limiters and such, you need an adjustable clutch. The base pressure needs to be on the lower end of the pressure in order to easily shift gears at WOT. There are variables such as counter weight levers and added counter weight that can come into play but the basics are you need less base pressure.

 

Most all NMRA Coyote Stock cars run a G101a and shift clutchless with a diaphragm PP.

Grant

 

BTW: Long shifter, adj. clutch, flat-out gearing...

 

Did end up With a Liberty LSC5100. Tunnel had to be modified- alot. Luckily the mid-plate and tunnel-openeing to the engine bay could be retained. Although there is little room as I needed to og to a 164T bellhousing too.

All I need to figure ut now is how to use this thing for full RPM shifts. Do I need a spark- cut? How sholud the cut be activated?

As I understand- this is a "clutch-assisted" Box, however- shifted clutchless. But With or without a spark cut, that is the question.

 

Liberty will tell you not to shift them clutchless. I tried one day at the track to shift mine without the clutch. It didnt go very well. The shifter got stuck between the 2-3 shift and i thought i broke the thing. Luckily after i shut the car off and refired it the shifter free'd up and nothing was broken. It is really hard on them to shift clutchless, even with cutting the spark


Just give the clutch a quick tap and push and pull the lever.

 

I'm real happy with my G-101a so far.

 

You could also have a T56 Magnum converted to a dog box in the 2-4 gears.... keep 1st and 5/6 synchronized. They take a pounding and there is a 4000lb GTO plus a Ford Galaxie (both turbo'd) on Hot Rod Power Tour making around 1500hp running that trans

It is a heavy beast though at 140lbs without bellhousing/clutch etc.

 

Those guys were on rocky mountain raceweek, Rich with the GTO has a stock magnum, and Bill with the fairlane has a Liberty faceplated magnum, 1st gear is faceplated in the magnums, liberty cant faceplate them without doing first gear. They are definitely a good option for street stuff.

 

Have looked at the GSR. Getting temted..... I am a bit worried about the external shifting of the 101A. And as I understand, the GSR will take more beating too. Costs are marginal higher. But, still worried about hte H- gearing on the strip...

I had a look at Samsonas sequential 6- speed Box too, but suspect the costs to skyrocket- maybe double- so it might be out of my League.

 

Yo- what kind of shifter on the GSR? I’m sorry- cannot find any info on this right now as my mobile is somewhat f.u.

Sounds tempting to H- shift the 101. However- i see the coyote stock class run
10.4- passes. I am shooting for high 8’s. So the question is: are 8’s with a Long
H- shifter EASY?

Even started looking into man valvebody 4- speed autos aod and the like.... Spragless, non lockup, 5000+ stall. .... how would something like that be for downshifting?

Alot of useful info for a beginner right here. Thank you, guys.

 

The GForce GSR has internal shift rails and packages easier without lots of tunnel mods.

I had one in my 2470lb RX-7 running a 438ci LS7 and 18x12's at all corners. Full road race track car.... shifts were fast and VOILENT. I loved the transmission. Ran a 13lb QuarterMaster 5.25" triple disc clutch/flywheel setup. Not a streetable clutch combo.... 1st gear leaving from a stop is very tricky.... once you get going it is heaven.

 

I just picked up a new G101A, Bubba said they are all clutch assisted now. They also now have a bearing support from the main shaft to the counter shaft. I was told to shift it clutchless. I'm just waiting to get out and see how it goes. The weather has sucked this year.

 

The G101a CA trans I have is with an H-shift pattern. I drive it on the street with no problem, and at the track it yanks right into gear as fast as I can move it with just a quick blip of the accelerator. After launch I do not touch the clutch until I am slowing down. Had Cale rebuild my softloc this past winter and it is working well.

Yes the gears are loud, but the noise does not bother me, and honestly, with the engine noise, it is not all tat noticable.

 

The Coyote Stock guys have to run a H-pattern shifter in their class and have no problems shifting the 101 at the strip. I ran a vertigate on a 101 for 5 years just drag racing and seems like it would be a pain to drive on the street. You do have to pull the trigger to get back up into the 1-2 gate from the 3-4 gate. Reverse is handled by another lever when the vertigate shifter is in neutral.

 

Thank you for input on the shifters. I have gained Insight on the insternals too, so that's great.

I have taked to Cale about a trans/ clutch, and it might come together soon.

However- there is one more thing I nees to figure out before I purchase anything...

False impression on the vertical gate shifters: I was sure they were sequential type- not so.
I understand- by watching utube vids, you can shift 1.-2. 3.- 4. sequential , you do not need to lift or sideshift the lifter or anything?

And when downshifting, 4. to 3. and then you have to lift something or whatever to go to 2.?

The vertical gate Pistol-grip shifter, With the handle. Alot of People swear by them... But; what does the pistol grip do???? I have no Clue.

Easier downshifting? Or getting into reverse?

Will the vert gate pistol grip shifter be useless on the roadrace track?
I would Guess a H-pattern stick will have too many downsides on the strip, though...?

 

i daily drive a faceplated gforce, with both h-pattern and vertigate shifters. either configuration is fine for the street, but if you are going to be on a road course the h-pattern will be what you want. The Long brand h-pattern shifter is still fantastic at the track. You will want the clutch assisted (one piece slider) variety so you can downshift and engine-brake. Also, I wouldn't worry about the noise of straight cut gears, I've always found the noise to be underwhelming relative to the sound of the engine.

Regarding shifting a clutch assisted box, I shift my car by tapping the clutch just enough to unload the slider, with the shifter preloaded it drops into the next gear effortlessly. You'll have no issue shifting at 8K rpm. I have 4 summers of street driving + a few passes on one tranny and sliders still look fine, no burs. If you rev match downshifts and either double clutch or finesse the upshifts you can extend the intervals between service. Some of the others have more passes on their stuff so they can comment on passes until service

 

Just for info, a 101A makes a LOT of noise cruising on the street. It's great when you're banging on it but annoying the rest of the time.

 

Thanks, Bill and Doug. I C difference on the slider ramps, and figure shifting will be as quick as one can handle the stick...

This look pretty much like what we Call dogrings (and a dogbox), a bit different than the faceplated stuff.

The gears look quite beefy. OK; need to do a decision here... some of my pals suggest I go auto, but I'm not sure that is what I want. This will probably be good for me... as long as I manage to shift correct and keep the dogs as supposed to. If they start wearing....

Anyone care to suggest number of runs (1/4 mile) With 3000lbs and 800Hp before the dogrings need changing, supposedly shifted in the correct manner?
(In rallycross and asphalt I figure dogrings changed at least once a year....)