Also if I should run a girdle which ones are best? I have crane gold roller rockers

 

Yes they are. You want valve train stability. The only way I wouldn't run a girdle is unless I had shaft rockers. You won't go wrong with most girdles but I don't like the U bolt style. Have a look around you can probably find a used set.

 

Make sure you get the correct one spaced for your heads studs, I like Jomar girdles.

 

Valve spacing can be different. If you got the wrong ones, your probably doing more harm than good

 

Jomar. The original maker of stud girdles. Call them for correct part number for your heads. Good people to deal with. Girdles and nuts are 2 separate numbers. Need to know what your rocker arm size is where the nuts meet the rocker trunnion. .500", .560", .600". (Whatever you polylock diameter is.) Then you can look for a dealer and see if price is cheaper.

 

Thanks everyone. i just checked out Jomar site and his are priced real cheap compared to lots of others. And yeah I will give them a call and order a set after xmas.

 

My AFR heads and girdle are never more then a.001 off just get a good one made for your heads it should be fine

 

If your worried about spendin a few more $ on a good one then your in the wrong hobby, it will cost more in time if its wrong or you dont use one

 

who said they were ever worried about what they are spending on anything? not me.. I have over 12 k into the motor already and honestly don't think It will be finished. I did say I was surprised that the Jomar bars were cheeper than most other brands and was surprised as they are what most recommend.

 

Could be cheap or bent studs and the girdle is fine.

 

I believe they are required. I had a set of Iron Bowties with 7/16th studs and with 140 on the seat and 350 open without the stud girdle it would deflect the top of the studs .003" just rolling it over by hand. Crane Gold Endurance Wide body 1.5 rockers. If installing the girdle changes your lash something is way out of line or flexing terribly. With my 8500 rpm 867 engine with 250/600 it didn't change my lash not one bit installing a girdle. What will change your lash is tightening the set screws too tight. Get a 3/8 drive torque wrench to add some consistency to your settings. Follow the manufacturer instructions for torque specs. When running the valves I never break the girdle loose unless something needs moved which it they start moving indicates something going away. Another big mistake is over tightening the girdle bar bolts. 25-30 foot pounds max for the aluminum threads. Going more than that and you could see them bend.

World Products recommends Part # 832005
http://www.theengineshop.com/product_images/product_pdf-pdf_file-157.pdf

 

All I know is every stud girdle engine I have ever set the valves on, if all valves are set perfect before you install the girdle, and tighten the girdle up, will change the valve settings. I may have always had the wrong girdle. I don't know, but they were all ordered for the head used.
Maybe im just unlucky.

 

I'd definitely get a set. I had a set on a Camaro, years ago and loved them. Once you get the lash set, you should hardly have to mess with the valves, again.

 

It doesn't make sense a girdle would affect the clearance on the lash. At lash there is no tension on the stud so when the girdle is installed it must be pulling the stud one way or the other.

Were these double bar girdles or single with U bolts? Did the bars slide on real easy or did it require some effort to get them on with the bolts only backed out minimally?

Did you ever put an indicator on the assembly to see what was moving?

I did and the girdle and stud on the .705" lift roller still moved a little but in the range of half a thousandths (<.0005") or less out at the ends. The only measurable affect should be a slight increase the net valve lift due to less stud deflection.

So they are moving did it change the lash evenly or were some different amounts?

Not trying to be smart but you got me interested on how this could be.

 

Im not trying to be a smart ass either, I truly try to learn everyday. In the 70's, when Jomar, I believe were the first girdles out, and this all pertains to the small block Chevy. The one with U bolts I used on 3/8th studs, and they would have to be set again after installation. They move up, down, left, or right enough to change the setting. I can't go through every scenario, but let it be said that I've seen girdles installed on almost every style 23 degree head from several big named engine builders, all later with 7/16ths studs and I have yet to see one that would stay perfect after setting the valves, and then installing the girdle. All in the last 30 years have been double bar girdles. I watched one guy set them, then install the girdle, and I asked him if he'd let me check. He did, and some were .030 off. Just went and set an econo mod pulling tractor done the same way, and only One was right on. Just relaying what I've found. If yours stay perfect, great. The ones I've done do not.

 

Also, the amounts differ quite often. And some are way worse then others. I also use the comp locks with the snap ring so height is always dead on, and slide the girdle on, and snug to spec in sequence. Once set the way I feel comfortable with, they stay set fine.

 

Does this make sense to you or didn't you ever think something was up? Do you have a theory as to why a girdle would be changing lash?

Which method do you use to set lash? Are you setting lash on both valves at TDC every 90 degrees in the firing order or are you using, set the intake when exhaust is opening and exhaust when intake is closing? And then the guys you double checked on? This sounds more like they are not fully on the back of the lobe and are catching a ramp.

Shawn

 

Intake when exhaust is opening, and exhaust when intake is closing. But I check both in three steps. Such as intake when exhaust is opening, then a touch further, and a small bump further. There is a sweet spot when maximum clearance is obtained, and this rule is just a good start. How the others checked I have zero idea. In my opinion, no stud girdle, or al least none I've dealt with are machined to not pull on the studs a little one way, or another. Once set, they will stay almost as good as a shaft setup. But are much more trouble. Just my experience.

 

Are girdles mostly for big lift solid rollers? Would girdles be necessary on a hyd. roller motor spinning 6800? Or would it be a waste of money? I have Afr 210's....just curious cause i have some gift card money to spend.

 

I'd put girdles on every engine that's stud mounted.

 

I look at it this way girdles strengthen, dampen some, help hold lash, drip oil on springs(jomar design more) and one maybe more thing but I can't rem atm, just thought it was 5.

 

OP, I have set of Jegs brand ones sitting here I will never use if your interested. Id have to look at the part# again because its been awhile. Cheap.