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What has casued the decline of this section?

8281 Views 156 Replies 53 Participants Last post by  Mista Bone
Is the decline of the section the result of Chris U leaving? Or was this section already declining when Chris U decided to leave?

Stan
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Honestly, I think it’s from the fact that in the grand scheme of things, there aren’t a whole lot of people racing fast, heads up, N/A cars anymore. Don’t get me wrong, they’re still out there, but the maintenance costs, extreme up front costs to build, lack of drive ability, etc… all are becoming the nail in the coffin for high HP N/A builds.

I.E- My good friend has a very high dollar N/A SBC- AllPro 245s that have been extensively modified, tons of compression, trick rotating assembly, $3,000 carburetor, etc…It runs very well, but is not street friendly at all, and is very hard on valvetrain parts/springs/seats. Not that it breaks all the time, it’s just everything is near its limit all the time, and its service life is compromised to gain performance.

My other friend has a stock block, cheapo rotating assembly LS with ported stock LS3 heads and a large turbo. Guess who’s is faster? And not by a little bit…..

This day in age, an 8 second car is not a fast car anymore. So to spend $25-30k on N/A stuff that really can’t be driven around reliably without being hard on parts, that doesn’t run any better than an $10-15k forced induction/nitrous setup just doesn’t make much sense anymore.

Not gospel, just my thoughts on why you don’t see too much happening in here anymore. FWIW, I love the high HP, max effort N/A stuff. But unless you’re class racing, it’s just not very relevant in most avenues anymore.
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The NMCA NA 10.5 guys are mostly on FB, I saw a buddy of mine post a clutch question and the guys discussing run that class.

One of the shops I use (GPI aka Gwatney Performance) is big into NA LS and LT combos, hold some records, they are primarly active on FB, have a private group specific for their own builds and customers.
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Is the decline of the section the result of Chris U leaving? Or was this section already declining when Chris U decided to leave?

Stan
Bigger question, is it that All 4 stroke engine forums are on the decline?

Speedtalk?
LS1SALES?
Modd motor?
Etc......

🤐
LS1Sales? Who is this Ed? :)
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The Pro Stock engine builders are who brought me here. Nick , Bob , 3v off the top of my head.

Current state of everything is what id point a finger at.
Is the decline of the section the result of Chris U leaving? Or was this section already declining when Chris U decided to leave?

Stan
Migration to FB/Instagram. I've tracked my retail sales by where the customer found us. 10 years ago the forums represented almost 100% of my sales and FB/Instagram 0. Now the forums represent less than 12% and FB/Instagram over 70% with rest being referrals.
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Interesting thread. I guess us N/A guys are becoming dinosaurs.
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Most forums are all but dead. It's moved to Facebook groups. Shame, because I find forums much more helpful and efficient at dispensing GOOD information. The established guys on forums tend to moderate the blowhards who think they know a lot more than they actually do.

Facebook groups are often like Kindergarten. As soon as a question is asked, you have tons of people waving their arms, shouting out wrong answers. It's highly annoying. Probably a dozen garbage answers for every one that is actually accurate and helpful.

As for n/a decline... Easy. The advent of the LS. These have extremely strong shortblocks that will stand up to a ton of boost/power... and they litter the junkyards. Cheap and plentiful. Don't need to do anything to them outside of a cam, top end and boost to make close to 1000hp. NHRA has almost ran its course, so guys are looking into more fun and affordable ways to go racing.
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Another contributor could be that more and more people outsource their work rather than do it themselves. The diy n/a engine/car builders are a dying breed. Generational change - Hand over the cash for someone else with existing knowledge and skills to build your engine then talk about it on fb.
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I only come to this section to see what Jim is building.

But back when I street raced(20-ish years ago), the N/A guys cracked me up. When they would want me to remove my bottle, I'd ask them why. Then I'd say that we both paid for power and that I just got a better deal.
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I know up here in my area, heads up grudge racing, no prep, no time eighth mile racing has taken over. Established quarter mile tracks are now used for just the eighth, and the shutdown areas are used for the no prep competitions. Majority of the competitors are using turbo LS setups. Hardly any weekend bracket racing exists anymore like it used to.
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One word...BOOST. New Coyotes, 2JZ, LS, Gen III Hemis, and the GTR RB engine...all of them can handle in excess of 1k hp on stock blocks, heads and cranks. A decent turbo kit is like 5-7k or cheaper, and the cars will have mild street manners. Most will still retain A/C lol. Nobody cares about an 800hp 540" bbc or a 700hp 434sbc that cost 10-15k to build...and drives like a tin can.
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The other thing I think contributed to this problem is the decrease in popularity of Pro Stock and NASCAR. Pro stock hasn't been relevant in the younger car generation in almost a decade. There are of course several reasons as to why this might be (advertising, NHRA & NASCAR having their heads up their asses, engines being out of touch, etc.) but regardless of what they are, most young people (mid 30's and younger) probably couldn't even tell you what the basic rules are anymore for NASCAR or Pro Stock.
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Face Book mostly. Face Book sucks. There are too many FB pages. This was one of the top go to places for everything and anything. Now every racer has a FB page, every builder, every vendor, every promoter, etc. You can’t keep up with all the pages. Did I mention FB sucks?
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Is the decline of the section the result of Chris U leaving? Or was this section already declining when Chris U decided to leave?

Stan
FWIW...

I stop by a lot less now because of a few of the twatwaffles that ruin good Tech threads with their constant personal attacks.

When the moderators fix some of this bullshit, it'll make a huge difference.
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One word...BOOST. New Coyotes, 2JZ, LS, Gen III Hemis, and the GTR RB engine...all of them can handle in excess of 1k hp on stock blocks, heads and cranks. A decent turbo kit is like 5-7k or cheaper, and the cars will have mild street manners. Most will still retain A/C lol. Nobody cares about an 800hp 540" bbc or a 700hp 434sbc that cost 10-15k to build...and drives like a tin can.
I'll gladly take my tin can.

I don't like anything that sounds like a bumble bee trapped in a pop can.
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I'll gladly take my tin can.

I don't like anything that sounds like a bumble bee trapped in a pop can.
Good For you
Migration to FB/Instagram. I've tracked my retail sales by where the customer found us. 10 years ago the forums represented almost 100% of my sales and FB/Instagram 0. Now the forums represent less than 12% and FB/Instagram over 70% with rest being referrals.
Hey! I just bought 55mm cam bearings from you. Went to web and there were some cheaper sets but I thought you deserved the sale. Maybe your first AMC 390 SS sale :)
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