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The problem with having this discussion with believers is you guys see there being a God as an absolute . As a non believer I have no absolute . Just nothing to believe in as of now . If there were a god he could easily win me over by simply showing up turn some water into wine right in front of me , or take someone riddled with cancer and cure them just with his touch , or even just touch my head and make me understand . ....... Should be easy for the creator of ......... Everything !!!!
 

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God is seen as incomprehensible by many believers.

The bible is filled with stories of God testing man's faith. Much more so than miracles or cures at any rate. Apparently God values faith above most other things when it comes to man.
Nah , don't give me that faith bullshit . The op asked what could make me believe . Faith is believing something with no proof ..... Sorry , can't smell it , touch it , or see it ........... I can't go on faith .
 

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Just to be clear Sam , I'm not trying to be an ass to you . I just get very frustrated with being told , just gotta have faith . In what other part of life is that acceptable other than religion .
 

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You misunderstand me.

You have no reason to have faith. God has not (I'm guessing) revealed himself to you.
Actually just the opposite , my life has been full of death and heartache as well as being screwed by anyone I ever gave a shit about or did something for on faith . I have found that life / people are to be taken only at face value . Kinda a prove yourself first thing for me anymore .
 

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Here's a thought....

If there is a GOD, I doubt he will send me to hell if I don't "believe" in him and run around insisting he is real.

Instead, he would probably realize that "faith" is optional and he doesn't need my acknowledging his existence for "godly" things in this world to occur.

Perhaps it's more important to GOD, if he truly exists, that I try to live my life being decent to those around me and not perpetuating bad feelings between the various factions - believers of various faiths that fight each other for "king of the religions" and whom all universally try to win over the "non-believers".

Maybe GOD would be more impressed with someone who is a good person for the sake of being a good person, not because they do so to avoid hell and get to heaven. ;)

With all of that said keep in mind that I'm mostly good so I don't lose my security clearance. And the little bit of racing "sponsorship" I get would dry up if I started being a lying, cheating, stealing, murderous adulterer.....:p
I agree . Kinda like getting a kids to listen by bribing them with candy ...... See what happens when the candy runs out .
 

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I did not make the rules , God did .


He does give you a choice . YOU make the choice .
Dont look at hell as a punishment, look at as a place that you will go to because you are with sin and cant enter into Heaven . When you are saved by Grace , ALL of your sins are forgiven from the time you are born until the time you die . Grace is a FREE GIFT from God , all you have to do is ask for it .

And NO, you cant get your hell insurance and go do what ever you want .
Jesus paid for all of our sins in full when He died on the cross. He will stand between you and God during judgement . If you have been saved by Grace , when
God looks at you through Jesus , you will be sin free and be allowed into Heaven.

You cant have it both ways .

God will give you what you want . If you want nothing to do with Him now on earth, why would you change your mind after you die ?

Remember , you are saved by Grace through FAITH .

God made it easy for ANYONE to accept Him .

Also, dont worry about the people of other religions or non believers .

God will judge them on why they did not accept Him . He will be fair and just .

As for spending eternity without Him and His love , that to me would be worse than hell in itself .
Wait , so people born somewhere else , not by choice , that never heard of Christianity or were taught that it's wrong don't get to go to heaven simply because of where they were born ????!!!!!!

Yea , that sounds like a just god .

You are just the kind of person who makes me sure religion is bull shit !
 

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Well actually there is. Simplest example I know of would a regular mousetrap. They consist of 9 pieces including staples. If you remove any one of those pieces wether it's a staple or a major component then it is no longer a functioning mousetrap.
A non functioning mousetrap cannot trap mice. Now imagine your first creature does not have all the functional reproductive parts it needs to manufacture offspring. Now we must start over again with the process....from scratch...from non-life...again.
To have natural selection you must first have nature that can reproduce.
Statistically if these random processes were true you would be witnessing macro-evolution happening before your eyes.
It may sound like a long time but 4.5 billion years is a drop in the bucket for what would be required if amino acids and proteins could evolve. The numbers of different permutations possible are staggering (like multiplying every atom in the known universe over and over) combine that with the correct folding techniques needed for a protein to be functional and the time necessary would be in ridiculously improbable.
We have over 30,000 proteins in our body...these are just the building blocks of life. We haven't even started with cells or DNA yet. Things are way more complex than our high school science teachers taught us. My anatomy professor once said " the human body appears designed but it isn't." when asked why not? He replied, " because it just isn't."

The human body isn't by design other than evolution . Proof of this is that we have organs we don't need to live , ........ Now .
 

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It is like beating a dead horse , it still won't move . Non believers seem to go out of their way denying God , it is a religion in itself .
No , it's not . Blindly believing in something because it was repeated to you over and over is a religion . Saying show me some proof is (at least should be) a normal function of an educated desicion .
 
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