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Collecting dust
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Discussion Starter #1
With all the F1R and SB nos nitrous guys out there who are parked, or dropping to Ultimate Street, I just don't get this.

The F1R can go 4.70's, and so can SB nos. I can't for the life of me understand why it's so hard to simply dial back the power of the turbo and BB nos cars.

The further apart the weights get, the harder it's going to be to achieve anything resembling parity.

The HP is getting too far apart. Turbo cars are now able to 60ft with blower and nitrous cars, so the old "I have to have more power because I can't 60ft with these blowers and nitrous guys" excuse is no longer valid.

John, I have a lot of respect for you, if for no other reason than taking the absolute BASHING you somehow tolerate from some of these guys, but it's way PAST time to dial this thing back a notch or two. You've reached a point where the nitrous guys have to spend a bunch of money to get to a weight light enough to compete. Even large frame turbos can't compete with the mid frames, and BB nos is already heavy.

I'm not even going suggest any changes because I have no desire to weather the shit storm of bashing that would result, but I hope you can see, equalizing (at least somewhat) the power of the combos is necessary. They can't just keep getting farther and farther apart without eventually driving people away.

I can't see any way to justify changing anything this late in the season this year, but I hope next year will see the HP gap between combos narrowed, rather than the weights between combos get wider.

I'm a turbo guy and I'd love to run the class, but right now it just looks like it's on a run away ET train. Nobody wants to have to buy a new turbo every time you turn around to stay legal, but the guys who are committed will do just that. They may bitch like hell, but they'll spend the money, none the less.

Bash away.
 

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Let's be honest here.


Only the mid frame turbo is doing anything. Bbnos didn't run a .50 anything this past weekend, And all the large frame cars were right there with the rest of the pack running high .60's and low .70's






So why would you change everything when only 1 is a clear adjustment, and the other isn't so much a threat as once thought.



Make all the 88's weigh the same, anything smaller has t really done much at all turbo wise so leave them alone.
Make the bbnos cars weigh the same at 3350 (the base weight for the tall deck combos)



Leave the new change alone for the sbnos cars and leave the f1r and rest of the blower weights alone and go racing.
 

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"Darkness"
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Good post. This class got out of hand 2 years ago. Guys like me with a non fox body sbnos car can't reach minimum weight regardless of how much money is spent. I also think its crazy adding more weight to the already heavy combinations.

I know nothing about turbos. Can you bolt on a reducer to dial back HP? A nitrous combination can easily be dialed back with jet limitations.
 

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Collecting dust
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Discussion Starter #4
Good post. This class got out of hand 2 years ago. Guys like me with a non fox body sbnos car can't reach minimum weight regardless of how much money is spent. I also think its crazy adding more weight to the already heavy combinations.

I know nothing about turbos. Can you bolt on a reducer to dial back HP? A nitrous combination can easily be dialed back with jet limitations.
Reducers are an outright lie. If you put an 80mm reducer on an 88mm turbo, it won't necessarily make 88mm power, but it will make far more power than a true 80mm. Reducers are a cheap solution but it would take a lot of trial and error to determine how small you'd have to go to reach the desired power level, and forward facing reducers are a joke.
 

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The nitrous guy
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It has been proven time and time again, that weight does NOT hurt the performance of a turbo car significantly. Now sure, you could probably put 300-400 lbs on them and do something, but that is not going to happen and would be unsafe anyway. The ONLY way to limit a boosted car, is to limit the power it can make.

Weight DOES help the nitrous cars, especially small blocks, as less weight makes the car easier to get moving and a nitrous car MUST get it done early to be fast.........but, even that does not remove the fact that nitrous cars are NOT going 1.10 60fts when the track is 135* like it was at SGMP during the day. So if the nitrous and boosted cars are even at 330 on a marginal track, a nitrous car will NOT win.

So in a perfect world, more equal weights and more equal power would make better and tighter racing.........I just don't know how you get there

Monte
 

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With all the F1R and SB nos nitrous guys out there who are parked, or dropping to Ultimate Street, I just don't get this.

The F1R can go 4.70's, and so can SB nos. I can't for the life of me understand why it's so hard to simply dial back the power of the turbo and BB nos cars.

The further apart the weights get, the harder it's going to be to achieve anything resembling parity.

The HP is getting too far apart. Turbo cars are now able to 60ft with blower and nitrous cars, so the old "I have to have more power because I can't 60ft with these blowers and nitrous guys" excuse is no longer valid.

John, I have a lot of respect for you, if for no other reason than taking the absolute BASHING you somehow tolerate from some of these guys, but it's way PAST time to dial this thing back a notch or two. You've reached a point where the nitrous guys have to spend a bunch of money to get to a weight light enough to compete. Even large frame turbos can't compete with the mid frames, and BB nos is already heavy.

I'm not even going suggest any changes because I have no desire to weather the shit storm of bashing that would result, but I hope you can see, equalizing (at least somewhat) the power of the combos is necessary. They can't just keep getting farther and farther apart without eventually driving people away.

I can't see any way to justify changing anything this late in the season this year, but I hope next year will see the HP gap between combos narrowed, rather than the weights between combos get wider.

I'm a turbo guy and I'd love to run the class, but right now it just looks like it's on a run away ET train. Nobody wants to have to buy a new turbo every time you turn around to stay legal, but the guys who are committed will do just that. They may bitch like hell, but they'll spend the money, none the less.

Bash away.
Cause nobody that's fast wants to slow down from 4.5-4.6 down to 70s and 80s. That's gay. The turbo bbnos and vortech are right there together. The f1x needs to come back and put a 2400 minimum on sbnos. If sb nos can't get that lite then they can run ultimate. Jmo flame away.
 

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Valdosta race was off the chain. Out of final 4 cars u had turbo bbnos and vortech and the vortech was a couple hundred pounds heavy still running 60s
 

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There is also something wrong with the picture when sb turbo cars are out 60' the bbnos cars. Not all but many
 

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Cause nobody that's fast wants to slow down from 4.5-4.6 down to 70s and 80s. That's gay. The turbo bbnos and vortech are right there together. The f1x needs to come back and put a 2400 minimum on sbnos. If sb nos can't get that lite then they can run ultimate. Jmo flame away.
love this post!!! :party
 

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Senior Member
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weight is a fine tuning tool, of hundredths not tenths. The problem is, most of the time when you have different combos within a few hundredths an adjustment really isn't that necessary. At this point you have to either give the combos falling behind more choices for power and even the weights up or take power away from the ones making the most of it. The problem lies with the SBNOS combo, it will always be the one with the least capabilities and at this point there isn't a lot you can give them to help them pick up the numbers they need.
 

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Collecting dust
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Discussion Starter #11
Cause nobody that's fast wants to slow down from 4.5-4.6 down to 70s and 80s. That's gay. The turbo bbnos and vortech are right there together. The f1x needs to come back and put a 2400 minimum on sbnos. If sb nos can't get that lite then they can run ultimate. Jmo flame away.
So a 1000lb swing between combos is the answer. Hmmm

Sorry I posted.
 

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Senior Member
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There is also something wrong with the picture when sb turbo cars are out 60' the bbnos cars. Not all but many
If it were the typical scenario where the turbo weighed 250-300 lbs more I would agree, but with the Mid Frame in X thats not the case. They are close to the same weight and IMO a 4.00" crank with a Turbo should be much easier to manage at the hit than a 4.250/4.375 crank and a .060 jet in the fogger. Just my .02.
 

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Cause nobody that's fast wants to slow down from 4.5-4.6 down to 70s and 80s. That's gay. The turbo bbnos and vortech are right there together. The f1x needs to come back and put a 2400 minimum on sbnos. If sb nos can't get that lite then they can run ultimate. Jmo flame away.
What he said. X2.
 

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If dean can go 1.11-1.14 consistently then the other bb cars should as well
 

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With all the F1R and SB nos nitrous guys out there who are parked, or dropping to Ultimate Street, I just don't get this.

The F1R can go 4.70's, and so can SB nos. I can't for the life of me understand why it's so hard to simply dial back the power of the turbo and BB nos cars.

The further apart the weights get, the harder it's going to be to achieve anything resembling parity.

The HP is getting too far apart. Turbo cars are now able to 60ft with blower and nitrous cars, so the old "I have to have more power because I can't 60ft with these blowers and nitrous guys" excuse is no longer valid.

John, I have a lot of respect for you, if for no other reason than taking the absolute BASHING you somehow tolerate from some of these guys, but it's way PAST time to dial this thing back a notch or two. You've reached a point where the nitrous guys have to spend a bunch of money to get to a weight light enough to compete. Even large frame turbos can't compete with the mid frames, and BB nos is already heavy.

I'm not even going suggest any changes because I have no desire to weather the shit storm of bashing that would result, but I hope you can see, equalizing (at least somewhat) the power of the combos is necessary. They can't just keep getting farther and farther apart without eventually driving people away.

I can't see any way to justify changing anything this late in the season this year, but I hope next year will see the HP gap between combos narrowed, rather than the weights between combos get wider.

I'm a turbo guy and I'd love to run the class, but right now it just looks like it's on a run away ET train. Nobody wants to have to buy a new turbo every time you turn around to stay legal, but the guys who are committed will do just that. They may bitch like hell, but they'll spend the money, none the less.

Bash away.
Good post. And exactly what needs doing! To bad no one has the balls to do what needs to be done! But that's fine to soon there will be a new class and this one will be dead. Just like ol10.5 and odr.

Max rider on shop computer
 

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If its gay to slow down go run odr. That Vortech is sporting a new billet wheel and have you seen the engine in that car? I get a kick how the turbo camp knows all the answers. Make all turbo cars use a 3.55 gear problem solved easy to tech. lol
 

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Collecting dust
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Discussion Starter #17
If its gay to slow down go run odr. That Vortech is sporting a new billet wheel and have you seen the engine in that car? I get a kick how the turbo camp knows all the answers. Make all turbo cars use a 3.55 gear problem solved easy to tech. lol
I AM a turbo guy, I'm just an outcast when it comes to certain people who have no patience with me.

BTW, 3.55 gear can be gotten around by going to a 3 speed and not using high gear .. just sayin
 

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If its gay to slow down go run odr. That Vortech is sporting a new billet wheel and have you seen the engine in that car? I get a kick how the turbo camp knows all the answers. Make all turbo cars use a 3.55 gear problem solved easy to tech. lol
You can't be serious!!! You ever heard of a three speed th400!!

Max rider on shop computer
 

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HeadCaseRacing
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Cause nobody that's fast wants to slow down from 4.5-4.6 down to 70s and 80s. That's gay. The turbo bbnos and vortech are right there together. The f1x needs to come back and put a 2400 minimum on sbnos. If sb nos can't get that lite then they can run ultimate. Jmo flame away.
TRUTH:smt071
 
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