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Old 03-22-2007, 12:15 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by MrMike990 View Post
Monty, I think need to move to a "free" state. A sawed off shotgun is classified as AOW(any other weapon) and in MI looks like it's legal only if it's classifieds as a Curio and Relic. If you are interested in other stuff as well, I can tell you how to fill out the paperwork.

http://www.mp5.net/info/sbsconr.htm


http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu...st/nfa_faq.txt

It looks like getting a C&R will allow me to get a fully automatic weapon? It shows yes in the michigan area but has a side note.. I'll keep reading.. Very interested
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Old 03-22-2007, 12:39 PM   #77
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Jim,

if you think those local store prices are crazy take my advice, stay away from customs.
LOL..

I know it is just that the few local shops mark things up excessively. And I am 45 minutes from from Columbus where the prices for the same pieces are usually a couple hundred cheaper.
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Old 03-22-2007, 02:22 PM   #78
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It looks like getting a C&R will allow me to get a fully automatic weapon? It shows yes in the michigan area but has a side note.. I'll keep reading.. Very interested
Monty, for NFA items including anything on the C&R list you still have to have it transfered from/through a NFA dealer. The C&R FFl allows one to buy and receive firearms that have been classified as "antique" by BATF without going through a regular FFL dealer.


You don't need an FFl to possees an automatic weapons or silencers. If you live in a state that allows those items it's a matter of getting the chief law enforcement officer(CLEO) in your area to sign off on the forms, being fingerprinted, paying the $200 fee and sending off the application and the prints to the BATF.



Here's generally how it works, assuming your CLEO will sign off on the forms.

1. Find an NFA item you're interested in, let's say a MAC9 for $3500. That NFA dealer may or may not request a deposit.

2. Visit your local NFA dealer and tell him that you want him/her to do a NFA transfer. You are at the mercy of what he/she charges, some are as low as $30, some as high as 10% of the item purchase price. They will want the S/N as they will need it for the forms.

3. Go down the police station have have your prints taken and request 2 copies on FBI print cards. If you can, have the CLEO sign off on the forms at the same time. I usually will write a "character" letter explaining background and my reason for needing this item, aka "investment purposes" ;-)

4. Go back to your NFA dealer with the signed off forms and fingerprint cards. He will request full payment (his transfer fee, item cost, +$200 BATF application fee) , if he hasn't already done so.

5. He will send off the forms to the ATF with your $200 M.O. and he will send the seller $3500.

6. Once the NFA seller receives payment he can then transfer the MAC9 to your local NFA dealer.

7. From receipt of payment it takes anywhere from 90-120 days for the FBI /BATF to run the background check and process the paperwork and return your tax stamp. Depending upon your local laws an ATF agent may request a site visit or you may have to register it or notify your state police as well. The scheduled visit is painless, as really all they want to see is that you have a secure storage place.

8. The BATF will send the completed paper work and tax stamp to your local NFA dealer.

9. Visit your local NFA dealer, he will then transfer the MAC9 to you. The tax stamp or a copy should be kept with the item. If you lose the tax stamp you are SOL.


Possessing NFA items without the tax stamp can and will get one locked up.
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Old 03-22-2007, 02:22 PM   #79
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Monty...look into paperwork called a "form 4". I'm pretty sure Mrmike990 knows what i'm talking about.
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Old 03-22-2007, 03:36 PM   #80
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MrMike,

why did you have to say "Silencer"? Very good information, but that word.
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Old 03-22-2007, 04:26 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by MrMike990 View Post
Monty, for NFA items including anything on the C&R list you still have to have it transfered from/through a NFA dealer. The C&R FFl allows one to buy and receive firearms that have been classified as "antique" by BATF without going through a regular FFL dealer.


You don't need an FFl to possees an automatic weapons or silencers. If you live in a state that allows those items it's a matter of getting the chief law enforcement officer(CLEO) in your area to sign off on the forms, being fingerprinted, paying the $200 fee and sending off the application and the prints to the BATF.



Here's generally how it works, assuming your CLEO will sign off on the forms.

1. Find an NFA item you're interested in, let's say a MAC9 for $3500. That NFA dealer may or may not request a deposit.

2. Visit your local NFA dealer and tell him that you want him/her to do a NFA transfer. You are at the mercy of what he/she charges, some are as low as $30, some as high as 10% of the item purchase price. They will want the S/N as they will need it for the forms.

3. Go down the police station have have your prints taken and request 2 copies on FBI print cards. If you can, have the CLEO sign off on the forms at the same time. I usually will write a "character" letter explaining background and my reason for needing this item, aka "investment purposes" ;-)

4. Go back to your NFA dealer with the signed off forms and fingerprint cards. He will request full payment (his transfer fee, item cost, +$200 BATF application fee) , if he hasn't already done so.

5. He will send off the forms to the ATF with your $200 M.O. and he will send the seller $3500.

6. Once the NFA seller receives payment he can then transfer the MAC9 to your local NFA dealer.

7. From receipt of payment it takes anywhere from 90-120 days for the FBI /BATF to run the background check and process the paperwork and return your tax stamp. Depending upon your local laws an ATF agent may request a site visit or you may have to register it or notify your state police as well. The scheduled visit is painless, as really all they want to see is that you have a secure storage place.

8. The BATF will send the completed paper work and tax stamp to your local NFA dealer.

9. Visit your local NFA dealer, he will then transfer the MAC9 to you. The tax stamp or a copy should be kept with the item. If you lose the tax stamp you are SOL.


Possessing NFA items without the tax stamp can and will get one locked up.
Silencers (oops, I meant sound suppressors) are not allowed in Michigan. Class III firearms I believe are though, as long as they conform to existing state laws for "regular" firearms (for one, it has to have a minimum overall length of I believe 26", with a folding stock folded). No SBR's (short barreled rifles), Class III or not, are allowed in Michigan. Damn communist state.
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Old 03-22-2007, 04:40 PM   #82
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Monty, open this up and go to page 186:

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...s/firearms.pdf
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Old 03-22-2007, 04:50 PM   #83
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MrMike,

why did you have to say "Silencer"? Very good information, but that word.
Yeah, yeah....suppressor or as my overseas buddies call them, sound moderators.
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Old 03-22-2007, 05:25 PM   #84
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Damn communist state.
Try living in California... They ban so much stuff, it's crazy. In my county, I can't get a CCW permit unless I have a notarized death threat. Yay Kalifornia.

Gunny, where do you shoot? On base? I have a membership to the range right off base, in Oceanside... Iron Sights.


My inherited Colt Police Positive Special:



and my new Glock 19:

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Old 03-22-2007, 07:17 PM   #85
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Try living in California... They ban so much stuff, it's crazy. In my county, I can't get a CCW permit unless I have a notarized death threat. Yay Kalifornia.

Gunny, where do you shoot? On base? I have a membership to the range right off base, in Oceanside... Iron Sights.


My inherited Colt Police Positive Special:



and my new Glock 19:

I shot with Maliboost and Gunny at Iron Sights just a few weeks ago. Pretty decent place but damn why all the paperwork..
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Old 03-22-2007, 07:23 PM   #86
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I just got back from Target Sports.

JG, the S&W M&P 40 caliber was being used when I got there. They had a 9 mm one but I was not interested in a 9 mm. I will head back up there in a few weeks earlier to fire that gun. They had a lot of good things to say about it..

Gunny, again I wanna thanks ya for all your help. I passed the tips on to David and damn the phucker can group shots now at 15 & 20 feet.. I put 4 1" dots on the target (forehead, throat, #10 on the chest and the base of the spine) and he was able to hit them all with the Sig 226 and 229.. The S&W was not a good fit for him nor was the Kimber.

I did not shoot but around 50 rounds today. I pretty much wanted David to know how to be a better shot. I feel a lot safer around him now
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Old 03-22-2007, 07:28 PM   #87
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Gunny, again I wanna thanks ya for all your help
No problem Monty, glad I could help, wish we could work together more.
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Old 03-22-2007, 07:31 PM   #88
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No problem Monty, glad I could help, wish we could work together more.

You and me both...
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Old 03-22-2007, 07:38 PM   #89
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I would like to show you some draw techniques, that is where it's at.
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You ornry bastard
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Old 03-22-2007, 07:43 PM   #90
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I shot with Maliboost and Gunny at Iron Sights just a few weeks ago. Pretty decent place but damn why all the paperwork..
No Shit? It's a small world.

I was there last night, and will be there tomorrow night as well. I seem to be shooting a a bit to the left and a little down with the new Glock, and throwing more flyers than I'd like. Granted, I only have 350 rounds through the G19 in two trips to the range, but still. It's all about the practice.
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