K&R Wiring Harness

[8TREEZ]

Sparky, What do you thing of the K&R kits?? Are they good quality, and do you think that a typical racer could wire their car with this kit?

Thanks, Keith

[Sparky]

Good question, allow me to elaborate:

Looks like another typical generic wiring kit.
The thing that I don’t like about all of these generic types of kits is that they don’t necessarily support one particular application, which leaves a lot of redundancies. They also have fused circuits, which when installed in a racecar, will surely blow due to the environment.

I have installed some of these types of kits in the past and walked away feeling that they are less then desirable. In fact what usually ends up happening is that I end up removing them per the customer’s request. Some of the reasons have been that it doesn’t go along with my installation and tends to look congested and bulky, problems with the boards and/or modules, over killing circuits with relays and fuses on everything including the lights, the use of Computer cables which are not suited for a racecar environment, leaves most people feeling uneasy about having problems with them. Trying to find one at the track in a pinch could be like finding a needle in a hay stack.

Furthermore, using a circuit board in a racecar is asking for trouble. Because of the violent nature of a racecar environment, the flexing and experiencing tire shake can create broken circuits and broken solder joints within a circuit board. We have experienced this many times with switch panel’s that utilize circuit boards. We usually see in the data that cars have shut down as the car experiences shake or if the car becomes violent.

For the do it yourselfer that doesn’t understand the circuits of a switch turning on a relay, these kits offer up the ease of running wire to a module where all the complexities are done. The end user is just running wire, which makes these kits desirable. But I feel from a durability and quality point of view they just don’t stand up to the test of time, due to the design intent and products used which are not intended for the environment.

How many other forms of racing (Road Race, Nascar, Indy Car F1), do you see these types of generic wiring kits involved in?
Most other forms of racing understand the importance of the electrical system and won’t chance something in a kit form that will fail and cost them a race. These race teams either hire out or have staff that design and build the electrical architecture that supports their particular applications.

Sparky

[Alex]

Good question, allow me to elaborate:

Looks like another typical generic wiring kit.
The thing that I don’t like about all of these generic types of kits is that they don’t necessarily support one particular application, which leaves a lot of redundancies. They also have fused circuits, which when installed in a racecar, will surely blow due to the environment.

I have installed some of these types of kits in the past and walked away feeling that they are less then desirable. In fact what usually ends up happening is that I end up removing them per the customer’s request. Some of the reasons have been that it doesn’t go along with my installation and tends to look congested and bulky, problems with the boards and/or modules, over killing circuits with relays and fuses on everything including the lights, the use of Computer cables which are not suited for a racecar environment, leaves most people feeling uneasy about having problems with them. Trying to find one at the track in a pinch could be like finding a needle in a hay stack.

Furthermore, using a circuit board in a racecar is asking for trouble. Because of the violent nature of a racecar environment, the flexing and experiencing tire shake can create broken circuits and broken solder joints within a circuit board. We have experienced this many times with switch panel’s that utilize circuit boards. We usually see in the data that cars have shut down as the car experiences shake or if the car becomes violent.

For the do it yourselfer that doesn’t understand the circuits of a switch turning on a relay, these kits offer up the ease of running wire to a module where all the complexities are done. The end user is just running wire, which makes these kits desirable. But I feel from a durability and quality point of view they just don’t stand up to the test of time, due to the design intent and products used which are not intended for the environment.

How many other forms of racing (Road Race, Nascar, Indy Car F1), do you see these types of generic wiring kits involved in?
Most other forms of racing understand the importance of the electrical system and won’t chance something in a kit form that will fail and cost them a race. These race teams either hire out or have staff that design and build the electrical architecture that supports their particular applications.

Sparky

Sparky,

Correct me if I am wrong....you mentioned that using circuit board in a race car is just asking for trouble correct???? Then can you explain to me why there is a circuit board in say.......MSD Ignition boxes???? Which have solder joints as well, not to mention, the racepak liquid filled screen which one would assume could cause a problem with as you say flexing and tire shake?? also the racepak modules which again correct me if I am wrong also have circuit boards and in addition the big stuff system again circuit board technology hmmmmmm, these are all products that you are an authorized dealer for, correct??? I am just wondering if you know a little more than MSD, Racepak, or Big Stuff

[Rick_R]

circuit boards that their components properly supported and the attaching wires properly stress relieved should have no problems. The circuit boards in ecu's and such don't have pressures from switches pressing on them, circuit board mounted switches can lead to problems down the road, not always but it is a possibility the repeated pressing of the switches can cause issues specially if the presser use the touch of a gorilla.

[Sparky]

Alex,
I gave my opinion plain and simple.
I’ve been doing this for a little while and in that time I have seen a couple of things. Circuit boards that are designed for an enclosure with proper strain relief and support tend to hold up better in a racing environment. Not to say they won’t fail, because sometimes they do.
But when you have a circuit board flapping in the wind with relays, circuit breakers and wire hung off of them, there’s going to be disaster.

Should I have just lied to Keith and told him it's a great product? Sorry that's not me, I tend to be brutal honest. I have seen problems with this stuff.

As for what I know, trust me there’s a whole lot going on here.
Ask any of the people with my name on their car.
I’m just not going to come here and share it with someone like you.

[Alex]

Alex,
I gave my opinion plain and simple.
I’ve been doing this for a little while and in that time I have seen a couple of things. Circuit boards that are designed for an enclosure with proper strain relief and support tend to hold up better in a racing environment. Not to say they won’t fail, because sometimes they do.
But when you have a circuit board flapping in the wind with relays, circuit breakers and wire hung off of them, there’s going to be disaster.

Should I have just lied to Keith and told him it's a great product? Sorry that's not me, I tend to be brutal honest. I have seen problems with this stuff.

As for what I know, trust me there’s a whole lot going on here.
Ask any of the people with my name on their car.
I’m just not going to come here and share it with someone like you.



Sparky,

No need to get heated!!! I was just stating that most of the electronic components sold on the market are designed with circuit boards. You should have clarified yourself to Keith, from what I understood you specified everything that uses a circuit board is a recipe for disaster, but don't all electronic components sold on the market have relays, circuit boards and a wire hung off them as well???? I understand that products sold have been tested to be safe and in good working order, if that was not the case then they would not be sold!! Every manufacturer requires to meet certain guidelines and specifications in order to supply the industry with a good working product in order to respectfully cater to the publics requirements and also to establish a respected reputation in the industry. Don't get me wrong nothing is perfect however now your changing what you stated earlier but I guess that is neither here or there.
I also do not require you to share anything with me, I am simply stating my own opinion as well